Post 2 – June 24, 2024
Chats with Trump Supporters
Title – Angry White Guy
Participant – Single white male, mid 60’s
Me: Thanks for agreeing to talk with me today. If you don’t mind me asking, why did you agree to participate in my project?
P1: Oh, I heard the rumors about your Liberal interviews and wanted to give you my two cents worth. (We moved from the cafeteria, where he approached me, to a vacant classroom – The door remains open, I purposely allow him to sit near the door hoping he would relax – He is sitting sideways in his chair, not looking at me, he seems unsettled).
Me: Good, I welcome your thoughts.
P1: I’m not sure you do, I think you being here is a problem.
Me: Why is that?
P1: You are just here to ruffle feathers and upset people. People like me and people I care about.
Me: What have I done to upset people?
P1: Talk your Liberal Bullshit, that’s what! We don’t want to hear that crap! We come here for a meal and fellowship, we don’t come here to hear your Liberal crap!
Me: I don’t speak to anyone that doesn’t approach me, other than to exchange greetings. So, if someone listens to me speak it’s only because they have asked to, like you did just a few minutes ago. (A poor effort on my part to deescalate the situation, for sure – He’s pissed).
P1: (Finally turns to face me) I didn’t ask to talk to you, I just wanted to set you straight mister!
Me: Okay, go ahead.
P1: What do you mean?
Me: Set me straight. Tell me anything you want me to hear. I won’t interrupt.
P1: I’ve said what I wanted to say – You don’t need to be here! Simple as that!
Me: Okay, well . . . Would you like me to ask a couple questions so you can see what I am doing during these interviews?
P1: I don’t care what you do. I’m not answering any questions I don’t want to answer!
Me: No problem, no one has to answer questions they don’t want to answer.
P1: Okay, whatever, get on with it!
Me: Alright, I guess the best place to start is to ask you why someone holding different political views than you upsets you so much. Can you explain that to me please?
P1: It’s destroying America, that’s why!
Me: I see, can you give me an example of what I might be doing that is destroying America?
P1: You support Joe Biden don’t you?
Me: Yes.
P1: Well, that’s enough! He’s tearing this country apart at the seams! (He’s very agitated, almost emotional – Turns away again).
Me: Okay . . . (He interrupts)
P1: He does whatever Barack Obama tells him to do. He and his son Hunter are just corrupt, in it for the money. Prices for everything are crazy! Crime is the worst it’s ever been!
Me: Well . . .(He interrupts)
P1: Don’t try to tell me I’m wrong, I’m not! That’s what you were going to do isn’t it, tell me I was wrong! I’m sick of that! I’m not wrong! Do you really think I’m wrong?!
Me: Yes, much of your information is incorrect.
P1: Based on what source? The Media? (Chuckles)
Me: Multiple sources, I . . . (He interrupts)
P1: Whatever, look I’m not playing this game with you. I don’t care what you have to say. I don’t care about your sources. I don’t care what you believe! I believe what I believe and there’s nothing you can say or do that will change that! (There’s a bit of a pause, and I decide to end the conversation).
Me: Okay then, I appreciate your sitting down with me. (I offer to shake his hand, but he just gets up and storms out saying something to the people in the hallway that I couldn’t hear).
I have had many different versions of this interaction over the last few months. Until now, I have not posted them. I didn’t think it really added to the conversation. But after getting several comments from many of you, suggesting that I was somehow more successful in getting these people to talk than you are, I thought it was important to post one.
I’m probably no more successful than most of you at getting Trump Supporters to talk, I just make more attempts.
PostScript – I had noticed, during my conversation with the Angry White Guy, that others were watching us and apparently talking about his behavior. After I moved back out to the cafeteria, and after he had left, several (6 to 8) individuals came by to assure me that he didn’t represent everyone there, and they apologized for his behavior. They said he was always a hot head.
I also had more people making eye contact, I saw more smiles. My not returning his hate and apparently won me some favor with those in attendance.
I was able to conduct two more interviews that day and scheduled one more for the next day I was planning to be there.
All because of Angry White Guy! If he knew how much he had helped me out, it might have upset him! 😉
Look for another new post later this week!
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Proud Navy Veteran 
I don’t pretend to be any better than you are at engaging with people who are adamant that they’re right, and perhaps I am much worse.
But what I’ve found is that I don’t attempt to convince the unconvinceable nor do I attempt to refute when that would take listening on both sides.
What I have found to be useful is to have the discussions in the open where others can see/hear the conversations, and find in me someone who approaches these topics with calmness, confidence, and a bit of humor.
There are many who are not yet settled in their minds what they believe or what they want to feel about certain topics, and when I have these conversations, I do so in the light of trying to be the reasonable adult in the room, one who has the ability to hold multiple ideas in my head and one who can help bring order to chaotic thought and conversations.
I do this in my social media posts and in my conversations in my local community. Rather than go head-to-head with someone determined to be poisonous in their behaviors, I will respond with care towards the person, but I don’t attempt – ever – to get them to “see” my point. I simply attempt to explain my position using facts, data, reason, and good will.
I’ve found this has made many many allies who want to find a comfortable position rather than one that requires them to be uncomfortable all the time.
Whether I posted about Juneteenth or Pride Month or Black History Month or Woman’s History Month, I drew out the comments from people who were determined to express their spite about these celebrations. And rather than respond to those posts directly with a point-by-point take down, I instead responded (not every time) with a reasonable remark about how we have many people, many celebrations in the US, that we are rich enough to be able to celebrate two things at the same time, and that our understanding of others and their differences is a strength.
And that got many other allies to speak out in support, mostly as calmly and as kindly as I was responding.
Sure, a few of the responses were angry because people are people, but in the main, people were kind. And the original commenters often didn’t respond further seeing no support for their viewpoints.
I’ve been doing this consistently for quite a few years, and over time I’ve seen the discussions about difficult topics become calmer and more data-focused. And even disagreements are discussed carefully and reasonably.
Is this going to “work” to change minds and hearts? I don’t know. But I see it as more productive than simply shouting people down all the time and calling them names.
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This is good advice, Stephen. Living in MAGA land & knowing many personally,puts me somewhat at an advantage. I don’t have to approach as a stranger or as a family member. Both situations are difficult bc you’re operating on a continuum where there’s a lot of resentment & anger. You have to let them talk freely & wait for them to ask for your opinion. They are living in an alternate reality, but can think critically like P2 (woman) did for Navy Veteran,IF they know exceptions to what they are told. She did this for immigrants she knew that didn’t fit the pattern of criminality. The Angry White Guy could be experiencing cognitive dissonance. When the ‘light’ starts shining thru, sometimes anger at how you’ve been duped is exposed. Returning kindness & patience for hate & anger is all you can do sometimes.
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I was struck by the anger exhibited by this participant at you. It seemed that he had all his talking points down but couldn’t take it any furthur than that and so to discourage YOU from probing any more, he resorts to anger. Which of course, just shuts down the conversation. Anyway, thanks for your work and for posting it here. Always important to try and understand. I look forward to your future posts.
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That was my sense too. Thanks!
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I was also struck by how much he wanted to share those “talking points” with the author and by the total lack of content they had, beyond resentment.It was naked tribalism and nothing else.
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